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Post by Dandy Dan on Sept 19, 2006 14:04:00 GMT -5
You'd need a new ECM ($300?) plus the throttle body ($200?) and a few sensors for sure plus you'd need to weld a bung on to your exhaust. At the absolute minimum it's a $500 job but I imagine you'll need more stuff like the wiring harness and possibly convert to 4V at the same time if Honda goes that route so I'd guess the actual cost is $500-$1500. You're better off trading your Ruckus in for a new one.
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Post by timberwolfmadcat on Sept 20, 2006 11:54:43 GMT -5
You'd need a new ECM ($300?) plus the throttle body ($200?) and a few sensors for sure plus you'd need to weld a bung on to your exhaust. At the absolute minimum it's a $500 job but I imagine you'll need more stuff like the wiring harness and possibly convert to 4V at the same time if Honda goes that route so I'd guess the actual cost is $500-$1500. You're better off trading your Ruckus in for a new one. Youd need an exhaust bung anyway for the aftermarket pipe so that really shouldnt count..... hey this is still a big if on that 08's get F.I anyways |
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Post by ZOOMER46 on Oct 22, 2006 16:50:26 GMT -5
I'm sure if and when they bring the fuel injection over here, I don't think they're going to make it any slower than it is. 'Cause we're more important that you.  the biggest restriction here i think is that, in europeland we have to have 50cc scoots restricted to 28mph by law,due to license regs with bikes. that ,and them trying to protect us from our own stupidity. |
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Post by Kami no Chiizu on Oct 22, 2006 18:41:23 GMT -5
See, over here it's state by state. Apparently a good portion just want it to be under 50cc. Mine wants it under 30 mph, too. But you know what, I got passed by a dude on a smelly two stroke when I was driving to work goin aobur 32 mph... I don't really think the cops enforce it much...
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Post by Dandy Dan on Oct 23, 2006 12:17:11 GMT -5
As an update, supposedly Battlescooter is developing their own big bore kit that is a bit more extreme both in price and displacement. I haven't heard anything that's certain and final but supposedly they are getting a run of the front 1/2 of our engine cases made with a huge sleeve that is supposed to make a 9hp instead of 5hp stock which is obviously huge.
I'm uncertain as to what's all going be included but you'd obviously need a huge piston too and then you'd probably want to port out the engine and you might need to machine the head too for bigger valves etc. I don't really know what I'm talking about but to get 9hp you'd need to be atleast 80cc I'd imagine which is a 48mm bore (38mm stock).
Anyways, rough prices being tossed around are about $1500 which I'd guess is gonna end up being $2g.
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8chpl
Ruckster
Posts: 158
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Post by 8chpl on Oct 23, 2006 15:44:52 GMT -5
They are probably going to stroke the crank, giving it a longer throw and using a shorter connecting rod to bring the piston to the same top dead center.. This plus boring out will give a significant increase in displacement.
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Post by Dandy Dan on Oct 23, 2006 16:02:20 GMT -5
They are probably going to stroke the crank, giving it a longer throw and using a shorter connecting rod to bring the piston to the same top dead center.. This plus boring out will give a significant increase in displacement. I don't think so, the max stroke we could run is about 48mm (stock 44mm) which only gets us up to 63.3cc even with the Chanito 41mm piston. With a stock piston you'd only be at 54.4cc with that amount of stroke increase. The gap between the piston and crank is currenlty about 10mm so even if you ignore things like the piston speed, 5mm is the theoretical max increase because (10mm/2) that's when it would touch but you'd need some clearance so 4mm is pretty much the max. I'm pretty confident 48mm is the max stroke and even if you resleeve your engine to swallow a 42mm or 43mm bore piston you still would be under 70cc which isn't gonna get us 9hp. I talked to someone who talked to Jason and they were pretty sure they're making a whole new case 1/2. Anyways, I'd love a stroker crank cuz it'd be a bolt in mod but I've put my plans to get a run made on hold for now because it's about $1000 for about 5cc which is pretty stupid and if Jason can get a whole new case 1/2 made for $1500 then that would be a way better way to go. I still don't really see how it's possible though with the liquid cooling ports flowing around the sleeve from the head to the case...you'd need to line those up somehow unless the plan is to convert it to an aircooled engine which is a crazy thought.  |
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Post by chanito on Oct 23, 2006 19:52:18 GMT -5
 I am totally surprised by this news, as i was under the impresion that Jason was against the big bore, but obviously i was wrong, i still have some left, and even though a lot of people ask i still have 9 left, so they do not sell as quick as i thought they will, the kit i sell will get the power into the 4.0 to 4.3 HP range from 3.3 HP stock, They claim the power will go all the way up to 9HP and that is twice the power the 58cc engine is making I can not get those number unless i can get the engine to rev into the 12k rpms and that involves a lot of head work (reworking the intake track, welding and etc) and still i doubt i can get higher than seven HP so my hat off to him, 
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Post by Kami no Chiizu on Oct 23, 2006 20:26:07 GMT -5
Chanito, you can just ship me one for Christmas, since they're taking up so much space.  |
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Post by Blackruk on Oct 23, 2006 20:59:11 GMT -5
There is no way I'd pay $1,500 for new engine - I could just buy another scoot. I much rather get one of Chanitos big bore kits, especially after they go on sale! |
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Post by puttingalong1 on Oct 23, 2006 21:58:44 GMT -5
I am totally surprised by this news, as i was under the impresion that Jason was against the big bore, but obviously i was wrong, i still have some left, and even though a lot of people ask i still have 9 left, so they do not sell as quick as i thought they will, the kit i sell will get the power into the 4.0 to 4.3 HP range from 3.3 HP stock, They claim the power will go all the way up to 9HP and that is twice the power the 58cc engine is making I can not get those number unless i can get the engine to rev into the 12k rpms and that involves a lot of head work (reworking the intake track, welding and etc) and still i doubt i can get higher than seven HP so my hat off to him, Perhaps I am wrong, but I think the nine horsepower that they are shooting for is crank horsepower. The numbers you are quoting for stock, and for your big bore are wheel horsepower if I am correct? Again..... This is just me guessing here, but I think you are closer to what they are claiming than you give yourself credit for. With my motor swap, I can hit over 60mph when I am dumb enough to twist the throttle that far.... Way too fast for the size of the bike, it's brakes, and unbalanced wheels. My personal opinion is that 45-50mph is the reasonable/safe top speed for the little Ruckus, and from the reports I have read.... Your big bore can do this when properly tuned. Granted more power would be good for acceleration, hills, and wind..... I am not convinced the high cost of this other mod is justified unless you are well off enough that it does not matter. I guess time will tell, and it is not really fair to compare the two when noone really has any concrete details on what the BSS kit may do. |
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Post by ZOOMER46 on Oct 24, 2006 1:07:59 GMT -5
if you love your bike and have the money,
its worth it. and as the price of bikes come down 2nd hand
it will be even more justified.
and we always complain of more power.
there is probably a 1000 owners who spent$1500 and their bikes are
only better to look at.
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Post by wickedsf on Oct 24, 2006 15:54:02 GMT -5
The way I look at it is that if there are people willing to spend 1000-1500 for DIO brake conversion set, there will be people that will spend the money for the Big Bore.
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Post by timberwolfmadcat on Oct 24, 2006 16:02:56 GMT -5
I am totally surprised by this news, as i was under the impresion that Jason was against the big bore, but obviously i was wrong, i still have some left, and even though a lot of people ask i still have 9 left, so they do not sell as quick as i thought they will, the kit i sell will get the power into the 4.0 to 4.3 HP range from 3.3 HP stock, They claim the power will go all the way up to 9HP and that is twice the power the 58cc engine is making I can not get those number unless i can get the engine to rev into the 12k rpms and that involves a lot of head work (reworking the intake track, welding and etc) and still i doubt i can get higher than seven HP so my hat off to him, As soon as i get off my lazy rear and get it installed on mine youll have the 3 riders here in town ordering them  |
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Post by I Heard A Rukus on Oct 24, 2006 17:27:17 GMT -5
Mine is going in tonight, I hope I can get it tuned and ride'able enough to make it to class in the morning. We'll see......
KP
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Post by turbowagon on Nov 27, 2006 16:03:00 GMT -5
I began disassembling the Ruckus during lunch today. If all goes well, I should have the engine out this weekend. |
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Post by Dandy Dan on Nov 28, 2006 9:38:53 GMT -5
Nice stuff...keep us posted on your progress and results. It's always interesting to see what jetting combo people end up with.
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Post by chanito on Nov 28, 2006 22:38:14 GMT -5
The way I look at it is that if there are people willing to spend 1000-1500 for DIO brake conversion set, there will be people that will spend the money for the Big Bore.  Well i have not find 23 people to expent 300 on a big bore, so i had to hear my wife "i told you so" way too many times |
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Post by chanito on Nov 28, 2006 22:42:29 GMT -5
On a happier note Mr Ricardo from France have send me his 4 valve piston, and they are close enough to the 2 valve that they share the casting, so the price is the same as it will be if i do a second round of pistons, so the Europeans will get the benefit of us pioneering the big bore, if he goes ahead and get them done, we might have the big bore pistons ready for when we finally get the 4 valve head  |
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8chpl
Ruckster
Posts: 158
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Post by 8chpl on Nov 29, 2006 18:03:50 GMT -5
I wonder if you can make the 4 valve piston with a valve depression that just goes from one side to the other, That way it would work for the 2 valve engine as well.
What I mean is just having 2 depresions on the piston crown to each give clearance for 2 valves on the 4 valve and for 1 valve each on the 2 valve.
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