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Post by seyaat420 on Jul 11, 2009 18:58:32 GMT -5
USE 87 not any higher, the fuel does not burn as hot, you will go slower, and if you donot have a tach, you cant really know if there is a diffrents, I use to use 91 all the time, intel I found out what OCTAIN is actually for, its used for race cars to keep cooler because the added OCTAIN does not burn as hot, you feel somether cause your going slower.............but this is only for a stock honda ruckus and if you switch gas you wont useally feel a diffrence intell the gas is all burnt out.. About the battery thing, you can get a tricle charge on it, and it will probly work, this is off topic, but I have a solar panel on the back of my ruckus to keep it charge, for my alarm and electrick starter. I have never replaced the batery, and I used the electric start yesturday, But also remember I live in Hawaii, there is sun ALOT so the bike charges pretty well, proble would not work as well in overcast weather so keep that in mind, But im telling 87 is the way to go, better for the ruckus. And as far as ethonal I live in hawaii and the only area you can get non ethanol is at the boat harber, and pay a "edit profanity" load for it. I use chev,shel, and some local places with ethonal, and It seems to run alright, but I have heard of people filling up gas cans and comeing back, but also very expensive, and I dont have a truck or car, to do so,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,chris ;D
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Post by chanito on Jul 19, 2009 21:42:31 GMT -5
If an engine was design to use 87 octane fuel, IT WILL NOT MAKE ANY MORE POWER IF YOU PUT 104 OCTANE IN IT, back in my dinosaurs hunting days we run a bunch of test with different kinds of gas and octane grades, and ALL the engines (from a twin cam Alfa engine to a big block V-8) we tested produced more power with the least octane rating than did not produce pre-ignition or knocking. Of course there is always the placebo effect or wishful thinking
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Post by motherucker on Jul 24, 2009 22:59:45 GMT -5
I live in Wisconsin where a lot of the gas pumps have 10% ethanol. I read an article about someone burnning up his outboard motor with this gas. The dealer confirmed this problem, so I use premium just because it's the only gas not mixed with ethanol at the pumps in our town. Tell me what you know about this.
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sr50r
Ruckster
Posts: 281
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Post by sr50r on Jul 25, 2009 8:54:27 GMT -5
Hey chanito, I'm thinking perhaps those who feel an increase in power from premium might just have a bit too much carbo deposits? They might be getting a bit of pre ignition from 87 where it's not yet as bad as to cause full on knocking, but 91 would indeed make it run better.
But in this case using premium doesn't fix the situation, it's just putting a band aid on.
If anyone sees a power increase from running premium, I'd recommend they run some seafoam through their engine, it just might clear out the carbon and return the engine's ability to run well on 87.
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Post by chanito on Jul 26, 2009 8:24:59 GMT -5
Yes it is possible that the combustion chamber get some carbon if the scooter is not fully warm up, but the design of the combustion chamber and the high gas velocity should prevent it from happening, so maybe people need to realize that it takes about 15 minutes for the scooter to be fully warm up, and a long full throttle ride is the best way to keep the engine up to par, and also help those early (pre '06) motor from having comtanimated oil due to not having a full PCV system
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PrecociousApprentice
Guest
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Post by PrecociousApprentice on Aug 13, 2009 19:02:03 GMT -5
So reading all this, it has become apparent that people don't really know what octane is.
All hydrocarbon fuels (gasoline, diesel, etc...) are mixtures of hydrocarbon molecules. This means that the fuel is made up of molecules that are strictly made up of carbons and hydrogens. Most of these molecules are of the formula CH3(CH2)xCH3, meaning that they are just straight chains of carbon with enough hydrogens to will the rest of the bonds on the chain. This structure is what gives the chemical the sufix -ane.
Octane is a hydrocarbon chain with 8 carbons in it. That is all. It is similar to nonane (9 carbons), decane (10 carbons) and dodecane (12 carbons).
Now most fuels also contain many other chemicals, and not just aditives. Benzene is in most fuel, and it is quite a bit different chemically than the other hydrocarbons.
All this is somewhat beside the point. Octane rating has little to do with whether there is octane in the fuel. To quote Wikipedia;
"The octane rating is a measure of the resistance of gasoline and other fuels to detonation (engine knocking) in spark-ignition internal combustion engines. High-performance engines typically have higher compression ratios and are therefore more prone to detonation, so they require higher octane fuel. A lower-performance engine will not generally perform better with high-octane fuel, since the compression ratio is fixed by the engine design."
The octane rating number is basically the tendency to detonate, and is set on a scale with iso-octane at 100 and heptane at 0.
A general idea of how we get octane ratings can be had by comparing mixtures of iso-octane and heptane. A 50/50 mixture would get you an octane of 50. An 80/20 mixture would get you an 80 octane. A 30/70 mixture would get you a 30 octane rating.
You do not have to have octane in the fuel to have an octane rating. Remember, octane rating is just an expression of a chemical's tendency to detonate, as compared to both iso-octane and heptane. If you had pure straight chain octane, your octane rating would actually be -10. That is NEGATIVE TEN. Even though you have 100% octane. Diesel fuel doesn't have octane in it and it has a 15-25 octane. Pure ethanol has an octane rating of 116! E85 has an octane rating of 105, and E10 has an octane of 87-93, depending on the hydrocarbon fuel used in the mixture.
All this is information for a research standpoint. Real octane levels from real gas stations are always lower than these, and often lower than the reported octane rating on the pump, becaues the fuels are not as pure as the research reagents.
What does that mean for us Ruckers? Do what Honda tells you to do. They use real science to figure these things out. Everyone else is just spouting opinion.
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Post by Kami no Chiizu on Aug 14, 2009 1:04:35 GMT -5
What does that mean for us Ruckers? Do what Honda tells you to do. They use real science to figure these things out. Everyone else is just spouting opinion. My only rebuttal to this post is that for years Honda had incorrect information in the Ruckus specs regarding the size of the carburetor. They may test thing, but one stray keystroke can throw those tests out the window.
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Post by chanito on Aug 14, 2009 17:35:38 GMT -5
What does that mean for us Ruckers? Do what Honda tells you to do. They use real science to figure these things out. Everyone else is just spouting opinion. My only rebuttal to this post is that for years Honda had incorrect information in the Ruckus specs regarding the size of the carburetor. They may test thing, but one stray keystroke can throw those tests out the window. I am with Kamino on this one, if we were to follow Honda recommendations, we would be all using special motorcycle oil and avoiding energy conserving oils, plus a bunch of other little misinformations, like the like the dual acting brakes (which we do not have) and super optimistic maintenance intervals The best is to ask in a place like this or Totalruckus to people who has been around the ruckus for a while
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shawna
Junior Ruckster
Posts: 58
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Post by shawna on Aug 16, 2009 21:40:39 GMT -5
Someone should just dyno a Ruckus with different grades and different brands of gas....
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Post by gizmolabob on Jul 30, 2010 7:12:35 GMT -5
I am running a 355 in my 84 Monte Carlo. It has 10.5:1 compression ratio and has a terrible detonation problem upon hard acceleration. I am running the highest octane available where I live (91). Would a octane booster help with this problem?
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Post by jahair on Aug 4, 2010 20:20:13 GMT -5
I just bought an '09 Ruckus off of the dealer floor and in Colorado we have 85, 87, and 91. Should I use 85 then or 87 like most of the posts in here?
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Post by chanito on Aug 5, 2010 17:52:43 GMT -5
I just bought an '09 Ruckus off of the dealer floor and in Colorado we have 85, 87, and 91. Should I use 85 then or 87 like most of the posts in here? It is design for 87, so i would use that, but in high altitude you can get away with lower octane fuel
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Post by jahair on Aug 5, 2010 23:21:21 GMT -5
Chanito,
Thank you for the response. My girlfriend bought a Metropolitan the same day and I am under the assumption that that her Metro has the same engine so it would be better for both of us to use 87 octane correct?
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Post by Dandy Dan on Aug 9, 2010 13:42:26 GMT -5
Yup, same deal for both scooters.
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Post by jahair on Aug 9, 2010 23:50:30 GMT -5
Dandy Dan,
Thank you.
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Post by ruckozzy on May 20, 2012 2:51:42 GMT -5
Did some testing today changed the oil and ran it with 91 in the tank. Ran like a charm then i went ahead and filled up 87 and boy did it run shitty. My top speed went out the door and so did acceleration. I have a daytona cdi and can confirm that 91 runs better.
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Post by chanito on May 20, 2012 15:01:00 GMT -5
Nothing like a real world testing, congrats on your find ;D
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Post by trashytaco on Jul 26, 2012 17:14:20 GMT -5
What about 110 octane racing fuel I used 5 gallons and it run like a champ and smells really good too
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Post by ruckinronk on Aug 6, 2012 13:30:32 GMT -5
After reading this post I changed from the 92 octane to 87 octane. I didn't notice any performance change so thought great saving some money. After about 4 tanks of 87 I was going through my MPG chart and noticed that I went from a 95mpg (on average) down to 85mpg (on average), I was thinking of all the performance mods I had done wondering which one caused the MPG to drop, then I thought this is also when I went from 92 to 87 octane. So switched back to 92 octane and like magic my mpg was back up to the 94 to 97mpg, and the performance seemed to be better (performance could just be in my head).
The logic behind this post is sound, put the MPG real life doesn't seem to make sense.
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Post by skuuter on Aug 21, 2012 9:28:19 GMT -5
There is another "Benefit" to the Higher Octane Premium Fuels such as SHELL V-Power, etc. They contain more carbon cleaners than the Lower Octane Cheaper Fuels. I usually run a Tank of Premium through all of my Vehicles around the 4th fill-up or so. This will reduce carbon build-up around Your Valves, and Ring Lands on Your Piston(s)..... ;D
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